Sanofi August 2021 Wide

From The Rabbi's Desk - Corona Vaccine on Shabbos

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Date:
Dec 17, 2020
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31 min 39 sec
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Venue: YU Wilf Campus YU Wilf Campus

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  1. Title: From The Rabbi's Desk - Corona Vaccine on Shabbos
    Author: David Hojda ,

    Sholom Aleychem, Rav Lebowitz.I was wondering whether you might wish to further expand upon this teshuva. In NY, at least, the process for obtaining a vaccine, even for those who are currently eligible, like those over 65, is chaotic. This means that getting an appt is generally a matter of luck. You happen to get a text from someone that a certain place is offering vaccines --  and this is what happened with me. You jump to the link and then try to grab one of the available appointments. In my case, there were appts available on Shabbos and Monday in a government office, so I was able to get a Monday appt, B"H. A friend of mine, however, mistakenly made a Shabbos appt. Once he realized the mistake, he went back to the site and saw that, in the intervening minutes, all other slots were already taken. So, it was Shabbos or nothing -- with no clear path to getting a vaccine anytime soon. Gov Cuomo said that it might take several months before all of those over 65 would have an opportunity for an appt. The Shabbos issues would include: 1)Transporting documentation to the vaccination site. 2)Electronic summoning of a taxi or car service. 3) Waiting on line out side the building with one's documents and entering the building with them. (When I went, there was a 30 minute wait outside the building, even with an appt.)4)Written acknowledgment (with a pen) that you will be receiving the vaccine. 5)Choosing an appt date and time for the second vaccine -- and this is BEFORE your receive the first dose and is a pre-condition to receiving that first dose. (They will not otherwise give you the first dose and there is no way to "get back to them" after Shabbos.)  6) Signing that one has received the vaccine after one gets it. 7) Leaving the vaccination site with one's documents and going from there to some other place. (The vaccination site in question is outside the Eruv and is a government office, with no "Bikkur Cholim Room," no public area for waiting until Shabbos ends, and, in any event, the building would anyway be closing before the end of Shabbos.) So, waiting there was not an option, nor would it be reasonable to leave there one's vaccination card, Medicare card and Driver's License, used as ID. As for the lomdus, I wonder whether consideration should be given to פיקוח נפש עתידי, which has significant application in Eretz Yisroel, in many areas of public safety, particularly by Tzahal and the Police force. Examples would be routine patrols that are primarily for deterrent purposes and require issurei d'Orayssa. An interesting example would be the police's writing tickets for traffic violations. The justification, both for the patrols and the tickets, is their deterrent value, not because pikuach nefesh requires the writing of this ticket right now, just as the patrols are in order to protect people in the future, lest criminals and terrorists learn that no one will be watching them on Shabbosos. I was also wondering whether an individual's being vaccinated should be seen not just a matter of that individual's welfare, but as פיקוח נפש ציבורי, given the way that infected individuals would potentially be infecting others. In response to another point raised in your shiur, would add that even though those over 65 are "high risk," that would not necessarily be the case for all those over 65. However, they, like just about everyone else, is potentially a threat to their high-risk contacts. And I wonder the extent to which many individuals can both earn their livelihoods and completely isolate themselves from contact with those who might have the virus.Kol Tuv,Dovid HojdaMonsey845-304-8442

  2. Title: From The Rabbi's Desk - Corona Vaccine on Shabbos
    Author: David Hojda ,

    Sholom Aleychem, Rav Lebowitz.I was wondering whether you might wish to further expand upon this teshuva. In NY, at least, the process for obtaining a vaccine, even for those who are currently eligible, like those over 65, is chaotic. This means that getting an appt is generally a matter of luck. You happen to get a text from someone that a certain place is offering vaccines --  and this is what happened with me. You jump to the link and then try to grab one of the available appointments. In my case, there were appts available on Shabbos and Monday in a government office, so I was able to get a Monday appt, B"H. A friend of mine, however, mistakenly made a Shabbos appt. Once he realized the mistake, he went back to the site and saw that, in the intervening minutes, all other slots were already taken. So, it was Shabbos or nothing -- with no clear path to getting a vaccine anytime soon. Gov Cuomo said that it might take several months before all of those over 65 would have an opportunity for an appt. The Shabbos issues would include: 1)Transporting documentation to the vaccination site. 2)Electronic summoning of a taxi or car service. 3) Waiting on line out side the building with one's documents and entering the building with them. (When I went, there was a 30 minute wait outside the building, even with an appt.)4)Written acknowledgment (with a pen) that you will be receiving the vaccine. 5)Choosing an appt date and time for the second vaccine -- and this is BEFORE your receive the first dose and is a pre-condition to receiving that first dose. (They will not otherwise give you the first dose and there is no way to "get back to them" after Shabbos.)  6) Signing that one has received the vaccine after one gets it. 7) Leaving the vaccination site with one's documents and going from there to some other place. (The vaccination site in question is outside the Eruv and is a government office, with no "Bikkur Cholim Room," no public area for waiting until Shabbos ends, and, in any event, the building would anyway be closing before the end of Shabbos.) So, waiting there was not an option, nor would it be reasonable to leave there one's vaccination card, Medicare card and Driver's License, used as ID. As for the lomdus, I wonder whether consideration should be given to פיקוח נפש עתידי, which has significant application in Eretz Yisroel, in many areas of public safety, particularly by Tzahal and the Police force. Examples would be routine patrols that are primarily for deterrent purposes and require issurei d'Orayssa. An interesting example would be the police's writing tickets for traffic violations. The justification, both for the patrols and the tickets, is their deterrent value, not because pikuach nefesh requires the writing of this ticket right now, just as the patrols are in order to protect people in the future, lest criminals and terrorists learn that no one will be watching them on Shabbosos. I was also wondering whether an individual's being vaccinated should be seen not just a matter of that individual's welfare, but as פיקוח נפש ציבורי, given the way that infected individuals would potentially be infecting others. In response to another point raised in your shiur, would add that even though those over 65 are "high risk," that would not necessarily be the case for all those over 65. However, they, like just about everyone else, is potentially a threat to their high-risk contacts. And I wonder the extent to which many individuals can both earn their livelihoods and completely isolate themselves from contact with those who might have the virus.Kol Tuv,Dovid HojdaMonsey845-304-8442

  3. Title: From The Rabbi's Desk - Corona Vaccine on Shabbos
    Author: David Hojda ,

    Sholom Aleychem, Rav Lebowitz.I was wondering whether you might wish to further expand upon this teshuva. In NY, at least, the process for obtaining a vaccine, even for those who are currently eligible, like those over 65, is chaotic. This means that getting an appt is generally a matter of luck. You happen to get a text from someone that a certain place is offering vaccines --  and this is what happened with me. You jump to the link and then try to grab one of the available appointments. In my case, there were appts available on Shabbos and Monday in a government office, so I was able to get a Monday appt, B"H. A friend of mine, however, mistakenly made a Shabbos appt. Once he realized the mistake, he went back to the site and saw that, in the intervening minutes, all other slots were already taken. So, it was Shabbos or nothing -- with no clear path to getting a vaccine anytime soon. Gov Cuomo said that it might take several months before all of those over 65 would have an opportunity for an appt. The Shabbos issues would include: 1)Transporting documentation to the vaccination site. 2)Electronic summoning of a taxi or car service. 3) Waiting on line out side the building with one's documents and entering the building with them. (When I went, there was a 30 minute wait outside the building, even with an appt.)4)Written acknowledgment (with a pen) that you will be receiving the vaccine. 5)Choosing an appt date and time for the second vaccine -- and this is BEFORE your receive the first dose and is a pre-condition to receiving that first dose. (They will not otherwise give you the first dose and there is no way to "get back to them" after Shabbos.)  6) Signing that one has received the vaccine after one gets it. 7) Leaving the vaccination site with one's documents and going from there to some other place. (The vaccination site in question is outside the Eruv and is a government office, with no "Bikkur Cholim Room," no public area for waiting until Shabbos ends, and, in any event, the building would anyway be closing before the end of Shabbos.) So, waiting there was not an option, nor would it be reasonable to leave there one's vaccination card, Medicare card and Driver's License, used as ID. As for the lomdus, I wonder whether consideration should be given to פיקוח נפש עתידי, which has significant application in Eretz Yisroel, in many areas of public safety, particularly by Tzahal and the Police force. Examples would be routine patrols that are primarily for deterrent purposes and require issurei d'Orayssa. An interesting example would be the police's writing tickets for traffic violations. The justification, both for the patrols and the tickets, is their deterrent value, not because pikuach nefesh requires the writing of this ticket right now, just as the patrols are in order to protect people in the future, lest criminals and terrorists learn that no one will be watching them on Shabbosos. I was also wondering whether an individual's being vaccinated should be seen not just a matter of that individual's welfare, but as פיקוח נפש ציבורי, given the way that infected individuals would potentially be infecting others. In response to another point raised in your shiur, would add that even though those over 65 are "high risk," that would not necessarily be the case for all those over 65. However, they, like just about everyone else, is potentially a threat to their high-risk contacts. And I wonder the extent to which many individuals can both earn their livelihoods and completely isolate themselves from contact with those who might have the virus.Kol Tuv,Dovid HojdaMonsey845-304-8442

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