The 20th Century Attempt to Unite Conservative and Orthodox Judaism

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Date:
February 07 2023
Length:
1h 5min 7s
Downloads:
12
Views:
1620
Comments:
2

History:
20th Century CE 

Collections: R' Muskat The American Jewish Community: United or Divided?

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    Anonymous: 
    1. Title: On your Shiur on Conservative - Orthodox
      Author: Harold Klein
      Reply
      Dear Rabbi, I listen to one Shiur a day and your are on my go to list. I find your delivery and preparation admirable. For the most part, that goes for this shiur as well, with some caveats and/or points I would like to convey. Keep in mind I am a product of the Old Line of JTS' influence. My family - with others as well, lead what I believe is a life based on fully observant Judaism in the 5 Towns. The influence came from Rabbi Steinhart Z"L who attended JTS in the 50's and one can say a truly Modern Orthodox Rabbi in a mixed seating shul with an Orthodox charter. From him I learned a ton that inspired a thirst for learning and leading a halachic life. First, I heard a question with little response about the founding figures' approach to Bible Criticism. If you read Rabbi Schechter's speeches to audiences of rabbinical students you will feel as they were delivered to classes at YU with a strict approach. There and if memory serves correctly he communicated that higher criticism is worse than anti-semitism. Also, on commenting on the term "Modern Orthodoxy" his response was something like... how do you affix a term like Modern to something that is eternal? - Something to think about as the term Modern is so mistreated in relation to its intent, as may I add is "Conservative." Next, you had mentioned on numerous times in the broadcast how JTS did not focus on Talmud/Gemara. That needs clarity as one can argue with strength that JTS had the highest level of Talmud giants in the persons or Rabbis Lieberman, Ginsburg, Friedman, Halivini and others. I must repeat from all I have learned and heard - these were Giants. I would include R. Heschel who was primarily known for his Theology and Philosophy work. If you consider Torah Min Hashamayim that took over 10 years to translate into English while finding all its sources coupled with the fact as his daughter relates - he wrote it at night in 2 years without looking at a source - one has to be blown away. I believe when you said the Mordechai Kaplan was not observant - that may need correcting. My former Rabbi cited earlier said he was meticulous in his observance but went off the derech in his thinking. It would be important to also mention that the leading Rabbis of the Seminary publicly disassociated.with him. As I understand it which is important to consider, In the days of Soloveitchik and R. Lieberman there was also back and forth about a joint Beit Din. And, it seems that the "Lieberman clause" written for the Ketubah was ultimately adopted with some alteration in Othodox Ketubahs. I want to also note in consideration of your relaying the forbidding of Orthodox Rabbis in Conservative Synagogues as a point of irreconcilable difference between the organizations. Maybe the result of that is yes more learning and growth in our community from a Torah perspective - however - I submit also missed opportunities to inspire more Torah awareness and acceptance outside of our community. There are countless members of Young Israel that I have met that came from similar influences as I did. Taking this further - maybe the unsustainable deficit of Jewish purity we are witnessing could be a result of removing that influence. I always say how critical it is to have strong, inspiring models affect those not yet there in allegiance with making the frum frumer - so to speak. Just my thoughts.
    2. Title: On your Shiur on Conservative - Orthodox
      Author: Harold Klein
      Reply
      Dear Rabbi, I listen to one Shiur a day and your are on my go to list. I find your delivery and preparation admirable. For the most part, that goes for this shiur as well, with some caveats and/or points I would like to convey. Keep in mind I am a product of the Old Line of JTS' influence. My family - with others as well, lead what I believe is a life based on fully observant Judaism in the 5 Towns. The influence came from Rabbi Steinhart Z"L who attended JTS in the 50's and one can say a truly Modern Orthodox Rabbi in a mixed seating shul with an Orthodox charter. From him I learned a ton that inspired a thirst for learning and leading a halachic life. First, I heard a question with little response about the founding figures' approach to Bible Criticism. If you read Rabbi Schechter's speeches to audiences of rabbinical students you will feel as they were delivered to classes at YU with a strict approach. There and if memory serves correctly he communicated that higher criticism is worse than anti-semitism. Also, on commenting on the term "Modern Orthodoxy" his response was something like... how do you affix a term like Modern to something that is eternal? - Something to think about as the term Modern is so mistreated in relation to its intent, as may I add is "Conservative." Next, you had mentioned on numerous times in the broadcast how JTS did not focus on Talmud/Gemara. That needs clarity as one can argue with strength that JTS had the highest level of Talmud giants in the persons or Rabbis Lieberman, Ginsburg, Friedman, Halivini and others. I must repeat from all I have learned and heard - these were Giants. I would include R. Heschel who was primarily known for his Theology and Philosophy work. If you consider Torah Min Hashamayim that took over 10 years to translate into English while finding all its sources coupled with the fact as his daughter relates - he wrote it at night in 2 years without looking at a source - one has to be blown away. I believe when you said the Mordechai Kaplan was not observant - that may need correcting. My former Rabbi cited earlier said he was meticulous in his observance but went off the derech in his thinking. It would be important to also mention that the leading Rabbis of the Seminary publicly disassociated.with him. As I understand it which is important to consider, In the days of Soloveitchik and R. Lieberman there was also back and forth about a joint Beit Din. And, it seems that the "Lieberman clause" written for the Ketubah was ultimately adopted with some alteration in Othodox Ketubahs. I want to also note in consideration of your relaying the forbidding of Orthodox Rabbis in Conservative Synagogues as a point of irreconcilable difference between the organizations. Maybe the result of that is yes more learning and growth in our community from a Torah perspective - however - I submit also missed opportunities to inspire more Torah awareness and acceptance outside of our community. There are countless members of Young Israel that I have met that came from similar influences as I did. Taking this further - maybe the unsustainable deficit of Jewish purity we are witnessing could be a result of removing that influence. I always say how critical it is to have strong, inspiring models affect those not yet there in allegiance with making the frum frumer - so to speak. Just my thoughts.

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